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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2019-03-25 PRC Minutes Amended CITY OF STILLWATER PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING March 25, 2019 Present: Chairwoman Linda Amrein, Commissioners David Brandt, Scott Christensen, Bill McGlynn, Sam Nelson (left at 8:43), Sandy Snellman Absent: Council Representative Mike Polehna Staff: Public Works Superintendent Tim Moore, Public Works Director Shawn Sanders OPEN FORUM Andy Wait, Settler’s Glen Neighborhood, asked the Commission to permanently deny the proposal for two ice rinks at Prairie Park. He found that many people seemed to not know about the proposal including those who attended the homeowners’ association (HOA) annual meeting. He feels the Parks Commission and the City Council were misled as to support for these rinks within their community. He provided packets with a timeline of the proposal, copies of HOA meeting minutes, and a petition stating that 86 out of 153 households didn’t know about any of this and are asking the Commission to deny the proposal because of how it went through. He stated that at their HOA annual meeting November 28 there was light discussion but the rinks were to be fully funded and maintained by the City. Questions about parking, noise and lights went unanswered. He said that at the Council meeting it was stated the HOA would help man the warming house and contribute some funding. Mr. Ambrose was speaking as a neighbor and Stillwater resident, not as an official board member while discussing the matter. The official position from their management company is that “whether they wanted a rink or not would be amongst them as neighbors and not the board or the HOA as a whole.” Unfortunately it was represented to the City Council on November 13 that the HOA wants this. More than half the residents do not want this to go through. He asked that if the HOA brings forth a future proposal, the Commission should consider how this one has been misrepresented. Kathleen Anglo, 3336 Webster Court, asked if additional concerns could be aired during open forum. Public Works Superintendent Moore replied staff is updating the commission tonight from the last meeting, which was in January, with more definite costs. The Commission has not approved or funded the project, they are still doing due diligence. Ms. Anglo stated she is a landscape architect and park planner. She said that when she heard about the park proposal she was quite shocked and surprised it had gone that far without her receiving any notice. When these proposals come forward, the Commission should consider the broad view. Does the City need another hockey rink? She said there are 6 outdoor rinks. She also sat on the community advisory board for the Comprehensive Plan and did not hear anything about additional hockey facilities during those meetings. Once a need has been established then the City should look at an appropriate site. Hockey facilities are better suited to Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 2 of 11 community parks than neighborhood parks. Prairie Park is within a mile of the service area of the Northland rink. Joe Dama, from the Settler’s Glen community, said he shared the concerns of Andy Wait and Kathy Anglo. He presented ideas for possible improvements to Prairie Park. He said many people do not oppose the idea of a seasonal skating rink but have concerns about parking, limited access, and increased traffic. He went over each concern in detail. The proposed rink would take up more than half the park’s green space. Short and long term maintenance of a permanent rink is another concern. He questioned, does the City have the ability, staffing and budget to support two new rinks? He suggested that the City instead put resources into fixing up and maintaining current rinks. There are large and small ponds that kids are currently using in the neighborhood. Dozens of kids in spring, summer and fall use the green space daily. The original plan for the development was to have a fully functional baseball, soccer and football field. He urged the Commission to consider the input of all the homeowners in the neighborhood. He asked that the Commission not proceed with existing proposals and ask the HOA to start over and develop a new proposal that would include input of the entire neighborhood. Commissioner Nelson asked if the statement that some homeowners have gone before the City Council and gotten approval is true? Mr. Moore stated it is not true, they went before the Council to present the proposal. Commissioner Nelson said he feels that the January Parks Commission meeting minutes do not adequately reflect the extensive discussion about looking at the whole City and whether there are other neighborhoods that would make more sense or are farther away from hockey rinks, and whether the City can support more hockey rinks. Commissioner McGlynn reiterated that it was conveyed to the Commission that the homeowners are all in favor of this. The Commission said, “we’re open to this if this is what your neighborhood wants,” but obviously that is not the case based on what is being said today. He thinks the proposal should be tabled. Motion by Commissioner Brandt, seconded by Commissioner McGlynn, to leave Open Forum and continue discussion on Prairie Park rinks. (No vote taken.) Commissioner Christensen stated that at the January meeting, staff had already gotten estimates. He asked what transpired before it got to the Commission? Mr. Moore responded it was brought to the Community Development Department by Ron Ambrose in December. Commissioner Christensen continued that he was surprised because it’s not the normal way applications are handled, to already have a plan, not really a plan, but a sketch, before actually hearing about it. He questioned how did this get fast-tracked ahead of some other parks? Mr. Moore replied the estimates were based on the proposal given to the City. Commissioner Snellman pointed out that as a board, the Commission has not taken action to approve anything other than to say, “it could be a good concept and get Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 3 of 11 some prices.” She thinks if homeowners don’t want it, the City should do a plan for that park and start fresh. Commissioner Christensen recalled that the discussion centered around “we’ve got all these parks and not a lot of money.” He recalled the estimate was around $85,000-100,000 or something like that which is about as much as the City would spend on a park in 30 years. He asked, would all the residents in that neighborhood want all of their money, effectively, spent on this one project? That is what he recalls of the discussion. Then the Commission questioned if it could be done more cheaply. Commissioner Brandt added that is what brought the CIP back to light in reference to the hockey rink discussion. Commissioner Nelson stated he would like to make it clear that he thinks the Commission should be open to finding out more of what’s going on here and reserve judgment, reach out to the other side and find out what were these representations that were being made. Any action on this needs to be held off at this point. Commissioner Christensen noted that’s what the consensus was the last time. Commissioner Brandt stated what the Commission approved was the concept of an ice rink to be researched further, not the actual building of an ice rink. Public Works Director Sanders (inaudible) . . . “come back to the Park Board in six months and say these are some ideas and how does this fit into the City’s overall plan.” He thinks that would get the neighborhood involved and open up communication between staff, the Commission and the HOA. Chairwoman Amrein asked, has the history been that the HOA can work on behalf of the residents in Settler’s Glen? Have there been other issues that have come before the residents that they have been able to resolve when they’ve had disagreements with the HOA? Virginia (no last name given), who lives on Macey Way in Settler’s Glen, replied that there is very little contact between the association and the residents. The only time she has been in contact with them is when she put a garden in her front yard and she didn’t notify them. Her mailbox is dilapidated and nothing has been done. The HOA is very hands off with everything. They don’t contact anybody for anything. They don’t listen. They do what they want and what a couple people decide they want to do. A man (no name or address given) stated they have tried to contact the HOA to sit down and meet with them and they will not, and they keep saying this is a City issue. There’s a disconnect. Some type of improvement may be appropriate, starting with a baseball field and maybe a seasonal rink in the winter time that would not cost a lot. He would like to see what the effects are on the grass at Bergmann Park before putting a rink at Settler’s Glen. A woman (no name or address given) stated the residents love their park. Mr. Sanders summarized it sounds like the HOA is not listening to the homeowners. He asked, “how do you get one voice to come to the City and the Park Board?” Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 4 of 11 A woman (no name or address given) stated the HOA is not going to meet with the homeowners on this issue. They have asked. Therefore the City should deny their proposal. 90% or more of the neighborhood didn’t even know about it. A man (no name or address given) said if there’s a long term plan or short term plan, “then we can go from there.” The HOA’s next step is they’re going to send out a poll to the homeowners and the residents have heard that it will say, “are you for the hockey rinks, against the hockey rinks, or indifferent?” He feels this is totally a biased poll. It should say, “are you for improvements, and what improvements are you for?” He would suggest that the Commission convey to the HOA “we’re not going to do anything until you meet.” John Biederman, Atwood Lane, suggested the Commission deal with this just like they deal with any other community in Stillwater. The HOA doesn’t speak for these individuals. The Commission should deal with the residents as individuals and leave the HOA out of it. Commissioner McGlynn reminded the residents the Commission did not approve anything. Commissioner Christensen clarified that he made the recommendation to approve a further look, bring the cost down and bring the proposal back to the Commission. Commissioner McGlynn said yes, but there was no approval of having two rinks. This is the residents’ HOA issue, not a City issue. He wants to make sure that’s clear. The Commission was trying to keep a discussion going based on a neighborhood that had some wants and needs in a park. Obviously that was a misrepresentation. The problem is, how can the neighbors trust their HOA? Commissioner Brandt said the Commission talked about holding a public hearing for the public to weigh in if it got far enough. Commissioner McGlynn agreed there would always be a public hearing before a proposal would be approved. He suggested the HOA meet with their residents and come back with some proposals of what they would want in the park. Commissioner Christensen said Mr. Biederman raised a good point. Shouldn’t the Commission just deal with the residents of a neighborhood? Why is it dealing with a HOA? Mr. Moore stated that what has been done in the past with park improvements is have a public information meeting and send out notices. This was just a proposal brought to the City. City staff has meetings with some HOAs. Commissioner Snellman pointed out that doesn’t need to preclude dealing with the neighborhood. Commissioner McGlynn stated that most HOAs represent the people. Commissioner Brandt said he still has the same issues with the proposal: it’s not budgeted nor is it in the five year CIP, so it may be five years before any type of program gets done in that park. Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 5 of 11 Motion by Commissioner Brandt, seconded by Commissioner Snellman, to table the proposal for ice rinks at Prairie Park to investigate further what park improvements would fit this park, with input from the residents. Commissioner Nelson asked for a show of hands for anyone who wants to speak in favor of the rinks. Chair Amrein noted there were no hands up. Commissioner Snellman added the Commission should look at an overall park plan and determine, with the residents and the budget, what will be the eventual development, if any. Motion passed, 6-0. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Possible approval of January 28, 2019 meeting minutes Commissioner Nelson stated that a third of the discussion involved, “does this actually make sense” and “we need to look City-wide.” He doesn’t think that is reflected in the minutes. He would like a paragraph added. Commissioner Snellman said it was alluded to when discussing the issue at the bottom of page 2. She recalls Commissioner Christensen asking where’s the money going to come from. Mr. Moore said he remembers Commissioner Nelson bringing up the fact of the close proximity . . . (the rest of his comments were inaudible) Commissioner Nelson said it wasn’t that long ago that the Commission looked at where all the rinks are. He feels like that whole discussion is missing. Chair Amrein said on page 3, in the last paragraph, the line above “prior to release of the plat” the word “from” should be deleted. Mr. Moore agreed to review the recording of the meeting to redefine the issues in the discussion. Motion by Commissioner Snellman, seconded by Commissioner McGlynn, to approve the January 28, 2019 meeting minutes as amended. Motion passed, 6-0. ACTION ITEMS St. Croix Crossing Half Marathon Mr. Moore stated an application was received for the St. Croix Crossing 1⁄2 Marathon to be held on July 27, 2019. The event is organized by Run Stillwater, the entity that does the half marathon on Memorial Day weekend. It will start in Wisconsin and finish on the Chestnut Street Plaza, crossing the river on the new bridge. The lift bridge will not be used. Stacy Einck, Baytown Township, coordinator, said this is one of a five-run series they coordinate. She reviewed the route. The last leg of the race has changed and will now use the loop trail rather than the roadway. Mr. Sanders said this is a change from what was submitted to staff. For the Parks Commission to give approval before staff has a chance to comment doesn’t seem Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 6 of 11 appropriate. The purpose of the loop trail was to be open to the public year round. He questioned the request for a two block section of the trail to be closed for the race. Ms. Einck responded that the route change was suggested by the Downtown Parking Commission last week. Originally they were going to come straight down Main Street but that would require them to block off a number of parking spaces, which was a concern. Mr. Sanders asked, regarding the alternate route on Sam Bloomer Way, what if Sam Bloomer Way is underwater? Ms. Einck said they put that there in the event that they need to move walkers from one side to another. If there’s a need, they can walk people down Main Street too. Mr. Sanders asked, if Kraemer and Sons are still working on Chestnut Street and they have their storage units along Chestnut, do the organizers still plan on having recovery food in the same location? Ms. Einck replied all of that is flexible and they will work with the space available. They don’t know what that area is going to look like yet. They need to figure out and plan accordingly. Commissioner Brandt said he doesn’t know if the City has ever shut down a trail for exclusive use. He added that the area by St Croix Boat & Packet is dangerous to come through because there are cars driving on the trail. He likes the idea of coming in that upper trail and the fact that there is an alternate route along the river. Ms. Einck responded that when they conduct the Stillwater Half Marathon, the first eight miles are on the Gateway Trail. The trail is not closed. They post in advance that the trail will be used for the marathon for about two weeks ahead of time. They could do the same thing here. With race marshals along the way they could enforce walking bikes and things like that. The biggest concern is if there were strollers and children who might not be on the lookout for the runners. They want to make the course as safe as possible. If the trail needs to be open, they can work with that, but need to staff and sign it accordingly. She will amend the original plan and submit it to staff to go through the regular protocol. Commissioner Christensen agreed that the trail to the boat dock is confusing and dangerous because of cars and people crossing. Ms. Einck stated they are talking with St. Croix Packet about helping them manage their perpendicular parking right along the trail, and if they need to buy spots for them to park in the parking lot above they can do that. She reminded the Commission this race starts at 7 a.m. and is completely over by 11 a.m. They also have been in discussions with MnDOT about using the bridge. Commissioner Christensen said he realizes they want to advertise this race. He acknowledged that they run good races. He asked how this could be done so it doesn’t have to come back to the Commission. Mr. Moore replied the Commission could recommend they work with staff for staff approval. Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 7 of 11 Commissioner Brandt reiterated that he doesn’t want the trail closed. Commissioner Christensen pointed out the Commission makes recommendations but the Council makes the final decision. Commissioner McGlynn said he is concerned about all the people walking across the trail to get to the boats. Ms. Einck said they will have discussions with St. Croix Packet and make sure that area stays safe for everyone. They have all other governmental agency approvals besides Stillwater. If they have to wait till the next Parks meeting, that’s OK. They can work with not having exclusive use of the trail. Coming down the road is not a good option because of the City policy not to reserve the parking spaces. Between the Oasis and Chestnut there are 70 parking spaces on Main Street. The Downtown Parking Commission had a concern that in the event of further water issues, any parking within the downtown area would be needed. It was not safety issues with runners using the road. They originally planned to cone off the fog line and let runners run in that corridor. Motion by Commissioner McGlynn, seconded by Commissioner Brandt, to direct the proposal back to staff for a recommendation, and then have it come back to the Commission April 22 and then the Council May 7. Motion passed 6-0. Opera on the River Public Works Superintendent Moore informed the Commission that Opera on the River has applied for a permit to hold an event in Lowell Park on August 10, 2019. Obed Floan, applicant, explained that the group wants to present an outdoor concert in Lowell Park featuring Stillwater native, opera singer Jack Swanson. Charles “Chico” Rouse Jr., general manager of Zephyr Theatre and Rouse Legacy, reviewed previous outdoor concerts he has coordinated. They do not plan to block any parking spaces. He said he learned that due to a City ordinance, people can bring their own alcohol, so they will not be blocking off a VIP area. They are trying to drive more commerce downtown. His experience stems back to 1988 running events for municipalities in New Jersey. Mr. Floan said they will open the park up about noon and allow people to claim their space. The concert starts at 7 p.m. They have been working with the Independent Business Association (IBA) which is in full support. The 40 x 40’ stage will be centered almost flush up against the gazebo. Mr. Rouse asked if there is power for 220V. Mr. Moore stated there isn’t 220, it’s all 110. The applicant would have to have a licensed electrician on site to adapt the power. Commissioner Nelson commented he thinks this is a fantastic thing to have in the park. He apologized for having to leave the meeting at this point. Mr. Moore clarified that the stage will face north so spectators will sit on the grass. Mr. Floan said he submitted an updated map after the original proposal was sent in. Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 8 of 11 Commissioner Brandt asked if the walkway along the river is going to remain open. Mr. Rouse replied the whole thing is open, nothing will be gated off. The stage will be set up between 7-9 a.m. Mr. Floan added that the concert will be done by 9 p.m. Mr. Sanders reminded the applicants that the City can get high water all year round. Mr. Rouse responded they have a contingency plan in place. Commissioner Brandt remarked that Commissioner Nelson probably would have wanted to make a motion to approve. Commissioner McGlynn said he would second it. Motion passed 5-0. (Commissioner Nelson had left the meeting a few minutes earlier.) Update on Prairie Park Rinks This item was discussed during Open Forum. Lindquist Resubdivision Park and Trail Dedication Request Mr. Moore stated that Scott and Michelle Lindquist plan to subdivide 2.06 acres of land located at 7817 Newberry Court North. The Comprehensive Plan’s park element shows no planned parks on or through the property. The contribution to the park system would likely have to be in the form of a fee in lieu of land, which would be $2,000 per new lot created. A trail on the north side of Boutwell Road North exists. Therefore, the contribution to the trail system would have to be in the form of a fee in lieu, which would be $500 per new lot created. The total park and trail fee would be $2,500 for each of Lots 2 and 3, for a total of $5,000. City staff recommends a cash dedication of $5,000 for Valley High Estates 2nd Addition park and trail obligations. Motion by Commissioner Snellman, seconded by Commissioner Brandt, to accept the staff recommendation of requiring a $5,000 fee for the park and trail obligations in lieu of land. Motion passed, 5-0. INFORMATION ITEMS Discussion of Community Center Diane Polasik said she is part of a group focusing on the need for a Community Center. She described past history of attempts to establish a community center in Stillwater. Two years ago she started talking to “the Y people” who said they get a lot of calls from people in Stillwater looking for a “Y.” The Y is supportive as long as there is call for it in the community. They checked other communities to see what works for community centers. She stated that Lakeview Hospital wants to keep talking with the group and they think it might be a great idea for the new property they bought. She challenged the commissioners to each think about what a community center means to them. The time seems right to bring this up again. Commissioner Snellman asked how the YMCA partners with communities. Ms. Polasik replied it’s a partnership. They work with the city. Her group is talking to Stillwater, Oak Park Heights and Bayport. Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 9 of 11 Commissioner McGlynn recalled when the Rec Center was built, Stillwater thought it was great but the City couldn’t fund it all. The key will be getting Lake Elmo and Bayport and everyone around to support it. Ms. Polasik added there also has to be buy-in from Stillwater Township. Commissioner Brandt said the results from the community engagement survey last year might be used, although it was pretty general. Ms. Polasik stated the school district is on board. They have talked to Community Thread and she [the Community Thread person] wants to be one of the board members if there ever is a board. They talked to the seniors who want a swimming pool and a place to walk. They have talked to Courage Center. They tried to work with St. Croix Swim Club but the Y was not the direction he [the St. Croix Swim Club person] wanted to go so they broke off with that group. She received email from a “department head” for the Special Olympics group saying they would love to have a community center. The Y is willing to work with the group on a program level before the facility can be built. Chairwoman Amrein asked if there would possibly be basketball courts. Ms. Polasik said the goal would be to not duplicate, but the center would need gyms and basketball courts. She doesn’t know what’s at the Armory but it doesn’t seem like it is well used. Her group has met with Councilmember Mike Polehna for the past couple of years. She asked how to get the concept to the next step. Commissioner Snellman remarked there hasn’t been any money budgeted for any of it. Ms. Polasik replied the group is not to that point yet. At some point there will have to be some money budgeted, possibly for a feasibility study. They would ask for money from everybody, including grants. They think they can find funders. They have not yet talked to the other city governments. They will go to Bayport in a week or so. Public Works Director Sanders commented that looking at a new building or facility is more under the direction of Community Development than it is Park Board. Commissioner Brandt said he gets approached all the time about the need for a pool and community center. Ms. Polasik told the Commission there is a family wellness center in Fargo that is a partner with the hospital system there, Sanford. It is not run by either one, it is run independently. Commissioner Brandt said the Commission never got any numbers on what an aquatic center would cost to run. There are centers that work well. Commissioner Christensen asked, “how did Forest Lake do it? How much money did the city put in?” Ms. Polasik replied something like $8 million between the Y and the City. Mr. Sanders commented that the Shoreview community center just added on significantly to their aquatic center. He read an article saying that it is not profitable Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 10 of 11 and the city has to contribute a lot of money to make it run but they see the need for it as a community benefit. Ms. Polasik noted that Maplewood had a community center run by the city which did not do well so they asked the Y to come in and run it. Commissioner McGlynn said if someone did a survey and got good results and people wanted it, then they could go to the City and say it is needed. Commissioner Christensen asked, “didn’t we already do a survey?” Commissioner Brandt said he didn’t think the questions were worded quite right. Commissioner Snellman said a feasibility study will have all the details that the Y will want. Ms. Polasik said her group can talk more to the Rosemount people about how they did it. Mr. Sanders asked, where would it be located in the City? There are not many large parcels available. Ms. Polasik pointed out that the hospital is losing part of their property to DOT and the City wants to put Curve Crest through the middle of their campus. Maybe it would go on that separate piece. Their board is open to continuing conversations with her group. They will build the campus in phases. If a wellness center idea goes through that will be one of the early phases. 5-Year Capital Improvement Plan Mr. Moore provided the updated 5-Year Capital Improvement Plan and explained the progress on several items. He will come back in a month or so with the budget and more information. Chairwoman Amrein remarked she would like to see the area behind the Pioneer Park bandshell, near the dumpsters, landscaped with some kind of designated path to get to the stairs. Currently people are walking on the grass. Commissioner Brandt said the Commission should prioritize what they want to start with. Mr. Moore handed out a picture of the Pioneer Park playground equipment that will be installed. The numbers were finalized with St. Croix Recreation on the state bid. The cost will be $187,000. The Commission budgeted $160,000 in 2019 and were hoping to get some help with this and not have to move funds around. But staff is now looking at what needs to be done to get the play structure done. The City could postpone some trail improvements this year to make up the $40,000 difference in cost. Mr. Sanders explained there are two planned trail improvements: one is along Curve Crest Boulevard from the Cub Foods entrance to County 5, and the other is Neal Avenue from Heifort Ponds to the Brown’s Creek Trail. Next year there will be improvements to Neal Avenue so the trail work there could be delayed another year and tied to that project. Parks and Recreation Commission Meeting March 25, 2019 Page 11 of 11 Motion by Commissioner Brandt, seconded by Commissioner Christensen, to recommend to the Council to shift $40,000 from the trail improvements budgeted for 2019 toward the Pioneer Park playground. Motion passed, 5-0. COMMISSION ITEMS/TOPICS Commissioner Christensen asked about the parking lot on the east side of Lake McKusick across from Harbor. It is posted two hour parking but he sees cars there piled with snow that have been there more than two hours. As a result, people who want to walk the trail now have to park across the street. Mr. Moore stated it’s a public lot. Mr. Sanders said he thought it was a 24 hour lot. He can check on it. ADJOURNMENT Motion by Commissioner McGlynn, seconded by Commissioner Snellman, to adjourn. All in favor, 5-0. The meeting was adjourned at 9:46 p.m.